HarrisburgNightlife

RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRediculous!

I heard about this when I was out and about last night, but I was a little to drunk to really comprehend what I was being told. I cannot believe this.

Left by yosh on October 5th, 2007

It opens tonight, and I’ll have the full story in my next column.

I think Konnichiwa means “hello” or “welcome.”

Left by Sara on October 5th, 2007

For the record, he didn’t throw money via that gold statue. That’s a recycled piece from one of his clubs in York.

The front page of the paper today mentions the theme, and you may notice that Rick Galiardo is Ron’s partner and they hired his kitchen staff to cook at Konnichiwa.

So, let’s just see how it goes before deciding the entire thing blows.

Oh - and it’s nonsmoking until 11 p.m. Not perfect, but a decent compromise in today’s growing nonsmoking trend.

Left by Sara on October 5th, 2007

I have to say that I agree with Mike. It does seem a little cheesy. I don’t exactly think Asian food when I see a diner car. Plus, there is a really great, well established Japanese restaurant right across the street. If I had to pick between the two, I would go with the established restaurant where I know what I am going to get every time.

I hope he succeeds, that isn’t the issue, but I have my doubts as well.

Left by Kim on October 5th, 2007

I think it would take someone with real vision to pull off the Asian in a diner car thing, but it could be done. Based on kamionka’s long list of past gimmicks I’m hesitent to believe this will work.

Left by yosh on October 5th, 2007

Downtown Harrisburg is a joke, excepting a few select places. It’s one big revolving door of destined-to-fail ideas. I’ve seen smaller places do better with their downtowns. It’s sad that Harrisburg can’t figure out what it wants to be and be committed to making it happen. Thank God for Midtown!

Left by HR on October 5th, 2007

yeah, thank the gods for midtown!

Left by yosh on October 5th, 2007

HR, what should Harrisburg “be”? It is what it is, a small city with a couple of good bars and a couple of bad bars. Last time I checked that’s every city in America. Except bigger cities have a lot of good bars and a lot of bad bars. The truth is it can’t be Las Vegas, Chicago or LA, simply for the fact it isn’t them. You can’t just throw 2 billion dollars into a bucket and say “here you go now go build some kick ass bars!” or say “everyone in central PA must move downtown so we can have a huge city”. Either make the best out of it or move to one of the “cool” cities, where only the elite of Americans live.

Left by Mike on October 5th, 2007

It needs to be more diverse and unique. Those two things don’t require ‘2 billion dollars’. Yes, Chicago and other big cities have more money and a better scene, but I would suggest one look to places like Bloomington, IN, Carbondale, IL, Charlottesville, VA, Ashville, NC - these places all have a very unique, diverse, and very much ‘alive’ scene, without the large buckets of money you allude to needing in order for something different to occur in Harrisburg.

As for moving…I wouldn’t move for nightlife, but I certainly will travel for a better scene and spend my money places that offer something other places confused about what they want to be.

And, I may offer that it may just possibly be the apathy and contentment with mediocrity that your comment exhibits that perpetuates the lack of creativity Harrisburg so needs.

Left by HR on October 5th, 2007

Funny. You think that Harrisburg should be more unique by being like other cities. That makes perfect sense to me!

While I used to view Harrisburg much in the same way as you, I have recenly began to open my eyes more, and I have realized that there are lots of active creative people doing really interesting things and networking together. Its just not going on in plain sight. A bottom-up cultural revival is definately happening and it is very interesting! Its just not going on at Tom Sawyer.

Left by yosh on October 5th, 2007

I think the diner outlasted its welcome about five minutes before it opened. And as far as being an “Asian-Mediterranean-Fusion Diner”, wasn’t it just a few months ago that Ron was on here bragging about how his venues were “not trendy, not chic”? How he tried to appeal to the masses? How he is explicitly NOT here to “turn Harrisburg into a cultural mecca”? In short, how his establishments are meant to be the Wal-Marts of downtown? Perhaps this post…

Left by floor9 on October 5th, 2007

Yosh said it best. We are growing, and we are developing, and we’re having fun doing it. But repeatedly opening up venues that are as cheaply done as possible isn’t helping. Compare the failure of South Street Tavern against the success of Smalls. A bland, no-name corner bar with poor service and average prices underperformed against a locally-unique venue that narrowly targets a very specific niche — who knew?

I’m all for downtown development, but it needs to be different. Opening 25 different copies of “Hey let’s make a no-frills bar that plays the same music people hear on the radio” will only succeed in diluting the downtown successes.

Left by floor9 on October 5th, 2007

“Its just not going on at Tom Sawyer.”

Well, now there’s upon which we can agree!!!!

Left by HR on October 5th, 2007

[…] The venue will reopen as Konnichiwa, an Asian-Mediterranean fusion diner.  Harrisburg Nightlife has the pre-roll, and watch Sara for the full details next week.  You know, for as snooty and cliche as Bricco’s “Voted The Least-Harrisburg Restaurant (LOL Get It?  Because Harrisburg Sucks And Everybody Here Is Stupid And Uncultured And Stupid and Harrisburg Sucks LOL!)” billboard is, this is exactly the sort of thing that keeps that cliche alive. […]

Left by Swing And A Miss-- floor9.com on October 5th, 2007

“Bloomington, IN, Carbondale, IL, Charlottesville, VA, Ashville, NC - these places all have a very unique, diverse, and very much ‘alive’ scene”

They all have something else, too — a college, which is something Harrisburg doesn’t have.

Left by Christian on October 5th, 2007

Too bad about Tom Sawyer’s. Yea, it was gimmicky, but I thought it was a damn good gimmick. I fear that the diner will eventually be uprooted and moved elsewhere. Just my thoughts.
On Harrisburg: I don’t remember anyone complaining about the lack of a scene when Metron was still open and kicking. There was NO downtown then! Seemed an awful good time to me. Now that we have something finally happening downtown, people tend to want to complain. But, I feel these people, while they piss and moan, really want it to become something more. I really think it will just take time. All these HUGE BIG GLITTERY clubs open and then there’s the fanfare and the write-ups and the anticipation. Then it opens and…oh well, another cover band/frat boy bar that will close eventually. No offense to frat boys or cover bands (i’m in one!). How about opening a modest little place and maybe building a clientele with good service and a great attitude? Think Small’s (although the owner said my band would never play there cause we play covers. I don’t blame him).
And how about a good coffeehouse downtown???!!!

Left by Trent on October 8th, 2007

With Tom Sawyer closed for the winter, will we still see these guys downtown?

http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1767460

Right, they’ll all be at The Quarter or Hardware Bar.

Left by KC on October 9th, 2007

TRENT: I think that’s part of the problem. “Modest little bars with no frills and good attitude” are a good idea, but that doesn’t mean we need 27 of them on Second Street. I don’t want to mention any names, but this is why South Street Saloon, Big Cans, Cabana, Noma Remixed, The Quarter, 5:01, whatever the second floor of Eclipse was called before it was Big Cans (Bed? Some comedy club?), and Tom Sawyer Diner all are struggling and/or went under. Don’t get me wrong — change is good. Reopening Wanda’s in a new location, however, is not.

Honestly, was someone sitting at home one night and thinking, “You know, downtown Harrisburg is really lacking in no-frills establishments that play mainstream music and cater to exactly the same crowd as every other venue downtown, because there really is no such thing as market saturation or fragmentation”?

KC - that is awesome. Even more hilarious is the fact that we all, with no effort whatsoever, can name at least a half dozen people — most of whom frequent Hardware Bar — who will look at that and think, “Yeah? And? I don’t get it.”

Left by floor9 on October 9th, 2007

I’m still waiting for some sort of upscale/loungey kind of place that plays house music. Oh, we had that (Prive), and it actually drew a crowd until the new owner decided to flip the format to hip-hop.

Prive did brisk business before the flip, which proves something like that can actually work in Harrisburg.

Left by danwxman on October 9th, 2007

There’s a reason why Cafe Fresco is always busy and has been so for a good stretch of time. It’s hip, it’s not gimmicky, it caters to an older (but not lame) clientele, serves a good drink, has no-frills good food, and doesn’t change with the wind. I think there is a place for a good frat boy/cover band bar - but like stated above, we only need one . Also, look at Mangia Qui and Suba. How long have they been around (okay, Suba is new)? I haven’t been to the Blue Bistro or whatever Jackie Blue has become, but I’m hopeful it too will be a place that is unique and lasting.

Okay, now before someone nails me on the last two places mentioned, I agree…they aren’t cheap - their prices may preclude some folks from frequenting. Again, we need places of all price points and that cater to all tastes.

Yes, I piss and moan…agreed. But, like mentioned above, I want more for Harrisburg. We patronize those places that are small and trying to achieve more. Again, if Midtown can do it, why can’t the rest of the city?

Left by HR on October 10th, 2007

I can’t tell you how much I enjoy reading everyone’s opinion. When I engage in a discussion, my first question is always…why?
It is never a statement of my opinion. I would like to know facts before I draw a conclusion and form an opinion.
I hope I never get to the point where one of my projects doesn’t get discussed. If they stop talking about you, you are doing something wrong.
The one thing you can always count on me for is change. So the topic of the day is the Diner, let’s discuss. After a year and a half of running a very profitable diner, I decided to make a change. (By the way, the outside won’t be changing.) Two reasons for the change: 1. I got tired of cooks not showing up for Saturday Sunday breakfast shifts and having to join in the fun in the kitchen and flip eggs. (It’s just not my passion or area of expertise) 2. It wasn’t a challenge to me, and if any of you know me, I get bored easily. The original idea when we purchased the diner and decided to move it to Harrisburg was to try to make it like the Continental in Old City, Philly. Somewhere in the process we lost our original vision and decided to start it out as a regular diner.
The time seemed right this fall to get back to the original vision. (I really do hate cooking.)
I am sure this project will be a journey, and will take a little time to find its groove and clientele, but it is worth the investment to me.
Just as my stock portfolio, I am diversifying our Harrisburg portfolio. I believe it to be a strong business decision. We have the Hardware Bar complex which is in need of no explanation. Bourbon Street, your average corner bar. Small’s which is our original music/punk bar. The Diner, which is our outdoor venue and now our up end lounge/restaurant. I think diverse is the word that sums up the Harrisburg properties.
On another topic, the second floor of the Hardware Bar building is now a casino and is being received very well. I have always thought of that floor as our evolving room. It is meant to change on a regular basis to keep the Hardware Bar Complex fresh. It is tough to advertise the same thing for 6 years so I use that floor as our, as some on it here might call it, my gimmick floor. It has worked for these past 6 years and I intend to keep that strategy going. And to answer a question ahead of time, yes I do have the next idea for that floor already planned out.
Thank you for taking the time to notice. That is very important to a new project. I also invite you to check out Konnichiwa. The kitchen will be up and running with the full menu in the next two weeks. The bar will be open this weekend.
The one thing you can count on from me is change; I continue to rely on all of you to talk about it. I never want to be the best kept secret in Harrisburg!

Left by Ron Kamionka on October 10th, 2007

I’m going to go out on a limb here and suggest that scrapping a business over an unreliable employee just might be missing the forest for the trees. Nonetheless: the point of the thread seems to be more to the effect that South Street Saloon = Bourbon Street = Hardware Bar = Cabana = Big Cans = the multiple other incarnations of the second floor at Eclipse = Wanda’s. It’s one thing to say you’re about change and challenge; it’s another matter entirely to actually produce it. The mentality that rearranging chairs and repainting walls is “fresh” and “diverse” speaks volumes speaks volumes about why downtown Harrisburg is being reduced to “minimum possible effort”.

Left by floor9 on October 11th, 2007

Please educate me a little better. What I’m picking up from you is: anything that isn’t EDM isn’t good. I Look at it from the standpoint of Early Dragonfly=Noma=Spyclub=Prive equals financial disaster. Let’s face it, the product just doesn’t sell in Harrisburg, not on a big enough level to make it profitable. There’s a reason everyone switched away from it. You can’t make money at it in this market. It’s a secondary market without the customer base to support it profitably. Since when did the tremendous success of Wanda’s make it a dirty word. I respect your opinion, trust me I do. I respect you loyalty to EDM and your desire to see it in a club format in Harrisburg. I just don’t see the crowd supporting it. I could be wrong, I don’t think I am.
I guess it’s a different point of view when you actually have to put your money on the line and make it successful as opposed to just having an opinion about it.

Left by Ron Kamionka on October 11th, 2007

I hate to sound like a broken record, but I don’t think EDM has been tried the “right” way in Harrisburg in years. Prive had a good thing going, and they always had a decent crowd there. Not pack ‘em in crowded most nights, but still a good crowd that seemed to be spending good money (I think I cut my checking account in half a few times there). Spy Club has perpetual promotion issues (and again, even it can draw a good crowd most nights).

EDM is working and coming back in many cities like Washington DC…and even those where you would least expect it (Mobile, AL or Columbus, OH?!?). It can in others too. It isn’t in places as well, like Philly….because club owners have the same mentality as those in Harrisburg (afraid to take a chance and try something new).

BTW, there is a certain club in midtown that has been successfully playing EDM for years. If someone could combine that atmosphere with something that attracts a more mixed crowd, it could certainly work downtown.

Left by danwxman on October 11th, 2007

Well let’s put the theory to a test. Put together an EDM vertical night, I will have it at the new property and let’s see if it works. I will be happy to meet with you and show you the new space and see if it is condusive to what you are talking about, I think it is. I will put whatever resources toward it that I need to if you can either find someone or program it and promote yourself. Best case scenario it works. I would actually like to be proven wrong on this. one.

Left by Ron Kamionka on October 11th, 2007

Uh….I’m probably dense…what’s EDM? I agree with Ron’s point at a certain level. His brand sells. The places we’re talking about here appeal to a particular type of person (think that freakin’ hilarious video!). But, hey…that person has money to spend and does so at Ron’s places. So, from a strictly financial viewpoint, I understand Ron’s point.

However, I believe, maybe naively so, that one can have a place that appeals to a more cultured, older crowd and still consistently make money.

I don’t believe the problem with Harrisburg is simple. However, could one factor that contributes to Ron’s continued financial success and our continued issues with downtown Hbg be that people have grown accustomed to the everchanging nightclub; thus, when a place like we’re describing on this blog comes to the scene, particularly if it’s a new creation of Ron, then folks are a bit skeptical and don’t really put much stock into it - feel they’ve seen it before and know it’s logical extension?

I think what needs to happen (and Thanks Bone for giving us a forum to put out ideas that might spark a solution) is that we need to start thinking of what we want for the downtown. From there, I really do believe that folks who have the money to invest in the creation of restaurants and bars, etc. can do so in a manner that fits the vision of those of us who put our money where our mouth is, in terms of patronage.

Left by HR on October 11th, 2007

HR, “EDM” stands for “Electronic Dance Music”. It’s a generic term used to cover all the subgenres in one fell swoop.

Ron, although I would like to see a strong EDM presence downtown, I as much as anyone understand that it’s not going to draw a 1200+ crowd. The EDM group is impossibly finicky; they will shun an all-house night because the DJ once threw in “Walk4Me” at the end of a set. Still, the substantial draw at last Friday’s 717 event at Spy Club shows that there *is* a formula out there that *wil* draw EDM people in Harrisburg. To only look at the bare numbers, drawing an all-out, oh-my-god-what-have-we-done, 45-minute-wait-to-get-in, smashing success at Spy Club would take about 300 people. That’s about 0.06% of the local metro population. Throw in an ARPU of $20 plus a $1 cover, and the month of November has just covered the annual electric bill for the building.

If I were able to wave a magic wand and take one single action that would substantially boost the draw of downtown, I would open up a handful of niche venues in the nooks and crannies present around the existing developments. Focus on pulling a sustained crowd of 50 - 200 at any given moment. Re-evaluating space within an existing establishment substantially cuts financial liability. Spy Club is a perfect example - Judd utilized his basement with minimal cosmetic renovations to present that dirty, gritty, underground atmosphere that meshes perfectly with the crowd. And the perceived physical isolation from the rest of the venue serves as a firewall between Dragonfly’s ultra-urban image and Spy Club’s target demo.

Let’s see The Quarter open up a rooftop venue with an iPod-night soundtrack and its own back stairwell. Let’s see someone move into the vacant building between Second Street Pizza and the garage. Let’s see a late-night coffee house with live acoustic or share-your-iPod night open up by the new development around Chestnut and Third. How about moving Eclipse (and those 812s) to the second floor and dropping in an upscale venue on the third, with improved (or utilized; you need a new LJ) lights, trendy decor, a house soundtrack, and premium beverages, utilizing the Pine Street stairs as an exclusive entrance?

To expand on what Bone said above, I agree that the mass perception of these venues is failure. The revolving door of downtown venues is transitioning downtown’s image from “up-and-coming hotspot” to “well, I heard there’s still this place over on North Street”. Rather than re-open the same venue under a different name and/or different address (but with “all new” seating arrangements and “the hottest” paint in town), let’s grow the niches.

Bone, well-said.

Left by floor9 on October 11th, 2007

[…] I have stated in previous posts that I think this is a bad trend for 2nd Street and hurts the Harrisburg scene overall. When people see the names change on a consistent basis it sends the message that Harrisburg cannot sustain the crowds, or that the nightlife in this city is saturated and failing. […]

Left by HarrisburgNightlife » Blog Archive » Smalls Never Saved The Scene on January 22nd, 2008

Bone, well put. If RK has the fortitude to talk about Market trends and taunts of put your money where your mouth is and show me how to make it work, then why has the only venue that hasn’t changed countless times are the venues that sell flesh, the Hardware bars. Where let’s face it the only product worth buying there is the sex. Following the strategy of sex sells the girls wear nothing and spending half a pay check there will barely get you the entirety of one under $20 bottle of liquor.

Left by Trance-o-phile on February 15th, 2008

O and by the way there are two great EDM venues at Prive or Privado’s (laughing at constantly shifting names) lower level. It has been a successful EDM venue for about a year now I’ve spent the past two New Years there and it seems to be doing well. Also the previously mentioned Midtown venue thumps EDM every night and does very well. Now after RK’s anti EDM comments … Mars reopens HA.

Left by Trance-o-phile on February 15th, 2008

[…] purpose as a family friendly retro diner, an astroturf “OMG party bar”, a short lived Asian martni bar, and finally a Mexican themed cantina. Better get your Cuervo body shots in because it will soon be […]

Left by HarrisburgNightlife » Blog Archive » Well…I never really liked you, but I’m sad to see you go. on April 8th, 2008